Discussion about this post

User's avatar
Gnuneo's avatar

Someone needs to calculate from a FUNCTIONING low-energy community - permaculture food production; cycle lanes; no BULLSHIT JOBS; little exploitation and lots of community-time; well insulated and designed homes; a small scale industry fx - and see what the minimum energy use of such an advanced and pleasant community would be, without all the wasteful.... waste.

I suspect it would be a great deal lower than what "Westerners" are used to. No sitting in traffic jams to buy a starbucks coffee before driving 200 miles to create online advertising that everyone hates.

We can survive, and thrive even, on a great deal less.

Somehow, I expect Greenlanders living in frigid wastes but with well designed and harmonious communities use considerably less energy per person than your average 'affluent' Californian community living in supposed climate paradise.

Once we have such calculated numbers, we could start - if we were an intelligent species, rather than one just convinced of its intelligence by the ego - to calculate a base-rate of semi-industrial survival, and also how long those increasingly scarcer materials and energy sources will last at such a rate.

As long as such communities are not infested by Xianity, or other "Go out and multiply" monotheistic religions, hopefully human numbers will continue to fall in 'developed' areas.

By far the most likely outcome will be humans choosing some 'strong' leader with no braincells, who will start a cataclysmic war - almost certainly over some tiny perceived slight, because that is simply how monkeys work.

Rationalising, not rational.

Chad Cassady's avatar

I appreciate this grounding realism. I still think "renewables" are worth it. I personally was never under the impression that manufacturing/mining could be decarbonized. And I'm getting too old to stake my ego on the future of life on this planet. I'm rarely certain where my next meal is coming from these days.

But I see no downside to putting the consumer electric grid on wind and solar and battery, nor to providing a better social safety net. I think there's a lot of intelligence and STEM talent in my position all over the world. If I wasn't so fussy about my next meal I'd go back to writing open source software, doing benchtop experiments, and playing music with my friends. I still do the latter, but the former is a little bit energy-intensive. I'm pretty depressed.

I got a good work ethic. I see the Big Problem as primarily social. It's the war culture, a big waste of fuel. II'd work a shift or two a week picking food. I don't own a car, I'm bici-only. I'm willing to (peacefully) renegotiate the social contract. But what we have now isn't working, and if we're gonna go down with the atmosphere boiling it'd be nice to do it a little more humanely on the off chance that some grassroots wizard figures something out to buy even a little more time. There's no reason not to do our best. I see a lot of people doing their worst, and that's pretty disruptive to the smart and sensitive process of science.

32 more comments...

No posts

Ready for more?